I went to an on line book Mein Kampf and this quote is not on page 403 http://archive.org/stream/meinkampf035176mbp#page/n443/mode/2up/search/page+403
- It depends on the particular translation and publication. This is the Reynal and and Hitchcock publication (which I prefer because it is pre-war), but the quote in question has apparently been cited from the Manheim translation of 1943. Unless a chapter reference is given, I cannot verify myself the existence of this quote. The discussion below, however, smacks of some truth, as I readily recognize the first part, while the second half sounds uncharacteristic
Why were several quotes dropped during the re-ordering of the quotes? I'm specifically talking about:
The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of the children, the people will happily endure almost any curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation.
I didn't want to revert all the changes, but could the person who revised it re-add the missing quotes or explain why they were removed? --Spatz 18:32, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
- That quote in particular is apparently from the Ralph Manheim translation (ISBN 0395078016). Page 403 of the 1943 version. What I would like, is for someone to go to a library and make a photocopy/scan of that page, so we finally have proof that it's really in there. And to check out which chapter it's in, so we can add it to the Mein Kampf article. --188.8.131.52 22:38, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
- You can search the Ralph Manheim translation on Google Books and the quote doesn't appear to be there (or in any edition): see here. This doesn't appear to be a real quote. Morish 14:36, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
- Update: logicalriot on reddit pointed me to this post which shows that it's actually a manufactured quote derived from a passage in a fictional letter written by Rabbi Daniel Lapin in 2004. So it's fake; end of story. Morish 17:20, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
- I was suspicious it might be a fake quote too, that's why I came to check it out. If it does turn out to be in there then someone can come forward with it. It is possible that not all content shows up on Google Books right? Unless it's all accessible (is it public domain?) When I checked SydWalker's site, he writes in his blog that while he did not say the quote above, he said an abbreviated version: "At least, he DID write in Mein Kampf (English Translation): “The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people.”" I am not sure even that is accurate though. I was reading the Gutenberg text here yet no segments of either of these quotes show up. The eleven times "the children" shows up in this translation he's not at all addressing topics like this. Tyciol 09:52, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
Rather than search for "the children", a search for "child" reveals this quote in Project Gutenburg's translation.."It must proclaim the truth that the child is the most valuable possession a people can have." - Cate, 11 August, 2010
- For further clarity in response to Tyciol's checking I looked at it, Cate's got it right. The section, however, is about eugenics, not mental control of the population.
See http://www.wnd.com/2004/01/22711/ The quote, -The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people.-; is in Mein Kampf, the rest is a fictional dissertation on that line. Just trying to help out.
The above mentioned site is questionable at best. From what I could tell, the text is supposed to be a letter from Hitler to Julius, however there is mention of him writing it after he shot himself to death. I looked at the German text at http://archive.org/stream/Mein-Kampf2/HitlerAdolf-MeinKampf-Band1Und2855.Auflage1943818S._djvu.txt and could not find anything that resembles the quote in question. Mein Kampf, Adolf Hitler, Publ. Houghton Miflin, 1943, Page 403
A V.I / Ch.10 quote on early marriage is included, but
Marriage is not an end in itself but must serve the greater end, which is that of increasing and maintaining the human species and the race. This is its only meaning and purpose.
is omitted, despite its relevance to modern debates on the definition and purpose of marriage. -- 184.108.40.206 04:47, 8 November 2009 (UTC)
Verification of quote
Can anyone verify if the following quote in the 'not yet placed by chapter' category is even in Mein Kampf:
- We were convinced that the people needs and requires this faith. We have therefore undertaken the fight against the atheistic movement, and that not merely with a few theoretical declarations: we have stamped it out.
I checked the Project Gutenberg link and haven't been able to find it. Wikiquote's article on Adolf Hitler has him saying it in a speech in 1933. Other sources seem to cite the speech for the quote as well. --Night Jaguar 04:45, 9 January 2011 (UTC)
- The quote is here (in German) date 1934. "Wir haben daher den Kampf gegen die Gottlosenbewegung nicht mit ein paar theoretischen Erklarungen aufgenommen, wir haben sie ausgerottet." *As a note, he literally says "godless movement" ("Gottlosenbewegung") which had a different, more political connotation than words like "atheist", e.g., atheistischen Organisationen; it is similiar to cold war usage of "Godless" in the US, but to a greater degree. --Downthatroad 00:11, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
I removed the following quote, because I couldn't find a matching version in Murphy.
- While the Goddess of suffering took me in her arms often threatening to crush me... my will to resistance grew and in the end that will was victorious.
I'm putting it here in case someone can find it. JesseW 07:36, 2 September 2011 (UTC)
There seems to be, for whatever reason, a trend in the quotes to focusing to a much higher degree than the relative amount of space they are given in the text itself. But it is not religion in general that is focused on, only what seem to be positive assosciation between him and Christianity is included on the page. This is especially blatant when the included quote is only a setup for a complaint about the inadequacy of anti-Semitism in Christians, e.g., The anti-Semitism of the new movement [Christian Social movement] was based on religious ideas instead of racial knowledge. The very next sentence he calls it a mistake writing: The reason for the intrusion of this mistake was the same which brought about the second fallacy. is ommitted. So it is apparently important to note that Hitler thought the Christian Social movement was anti-Semitic for religious reasons, but not not worth mentioning (until I added it today) that Hitler appraised their anti-Semitism as their kind of anti-Semitism did not upset the Jews very much, simply because it had a purely religious foundation. not to mention, calling it a sham anti-Semitism which was almost worse than none at all; for it lulled people into security; they thought they had the foe by the ears, while in reality they themselves were being led by the nose. In a short time the Jew had become so accustomed to this type of anti-Semitism that he would have missed its disappearance more than its presence inconvenienced him.... Another example: What could be more natural for me than to look upon the Abbot as representing the highest human ideal worth striving for, just as the position of the humble village priest had appeared to my father in his own boyhood days? is here, the next sentence, At least, that was my idea for a while. But the juvenile disputes I had with my father did not lead him to appreciate his son’s oratorical gifts... is of course ommitted. Whereas quotes like "And the founder of Christianity made no secret indeed of his estimation of the Jewish people. When He found it necessary, He drove those enemies of the human race out of the Temple of God." can be found twice, once with the following "But at that time Christ was nailed to the Cross for his attitude towards the Jews; whereas our modern Christians enter into party politics and when elections are being held they debase themselves to beg for Jewish votes. They even enter into political intrigues with the atheistic Jewish parties against the interests of their own Christian nation. " sentence and once with just the pro-Christian setup, and complaint about Christians ommitted.
Furthermore, a lack of context also adds to the misleading atmosphere. "As long as leadership from above was not lacking, the people fulfilled their duty and obligation overwhelmingly. Whether Protestant pastor or Catholic priest, both together and particularly at the first flare, there really existed in both camps but a single holy German Reich, for whose existence and future each man turned to his own heaven." is provided, however it is not mentioned that he is talking about fighting for Germany "not only in the trenches but also, and even more so, at home" during WWI, not his Nazi struggles. "Therefore, I am convinced that I am acting as the agent of our Creator. By fighting off the Jews, I am doing the Lord's work." Does not mention it what the "Therefore" is referring to, which was Hitler's opinion that "If the Marxist teaching were to be accepted as the foundation of the life of the universe, it would lead to the disappearance of all order that is conceivable to the human mind. And thus the adoption of such a law would provoke chaos in the structure of the greatest organism that we know, with the result that the inhabitants of this earthly planet would finally disappear." Since he thought Marxism was a "Jewish doctrine", he decided that fighting them would prevent the spread of Marxism and therefore prevent the destruction of the world. So he reasoned that "Eternal Nature inexorably avenges the infringement of her commands", therefore he would be the "Creator"'s work by protecting the creation from Marxism by fighting the Jews. It is not the religious nature, but the political one (ie, the Marxist one that existed in his mind) of Judaism he justified himself against. In Anyone who dares to lay hands on the highest image of the Lord commits sacrilege against the benevolent creator of this miracle and contributes to the expulsion from paradise. Hitler explaned clearly that he was using religion (something his readers understood) as a metaphor for Völkism, (a new word usage for them) and in fact spent the preceding 11 paragraphs doing so. So it seems extremely weird here that the quote is presented by itself as if Hitler was making some kind of religious revelation rather than focusing on the actual subject of Hitler's discussion, Volkism/folkism, which is instead ignored completely. In fact, this isn't even the first sentence of the paragraph, someone actual removed the first sentence of the paragraph, was "To undermine the existence of human culture by exterminating its founders and custodians would be an execrable crime in the eyes of those who believe that the folk-idea lies at the basis of human existence." Appartently, even after 11 paragaphs of explanation of Völkism, the quoter still managed to come out with the idea that the fact that Addam and Eve were expulsed from paradise was the important message to take from this (in fact the expulsion is quoted twice here) whereas Völkism, which Hitler considered the ideal state for his emerging 3rd Reich (Volksgemeinschaft), doesnt even get a mention! I don't know what criteria this page uses for quotes, but whatever it is that is a unbelievable. --Overalk (talk) 12:57, 4 August 2012 (UTC)
- I can't speak to the particulars of the quotes you mentioned, as I'm not particularly familiar with the works, but as for the "criteria this page uses for quotes" -- it's a wiki, it uses the same criteria as all wikis: the views of those who show up. A vaguely related guideline might be Wikiquote:Quotability, but, basically, -- if you see some existing quotes as lacking context, or having undue weight, fix it. If someone reverts or argues with you, bring it here. JesseW (talk) 04:30, 10 February 2013 (UTC)
Mention of the child being the most precious treasure of the state
Someone asked in "dropped quotes" if Hitler really said that or anything like it, and wished that someone could submit a copy of page 403 of The Manheim translation. I have the book, have scanned the page as a PDF. Just tell me how to get it to you, and I will
- If you have a wikipedia account, you can simply upload it. If not, there are many places to upload files. Do so, and add a link here. What would be even better (because it would make it more certain that the page hadn't been modified) is if you can find an existing online scan of the relevant page of theManheim translation, and link to that. Does that help? JesseW (talk) 04:20, 10 February 2013 (UTC)