Talk:Beyond Good and Evil

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From the translation by R. J. Hollingdale, ISBN 014044923X -- Jimregan 13:35, 14 Sep 2003 (UTC)

I've just been looking at the PG etext linked to from the en:Nietzsche article, and there's a bit of a difference in the translations of the quotes I had:

  • "A man of genius is unbearable, unless he possess at least two things besides: gratitude and purity."
  • "One is punished best for one's virtues."
  • "He who fights with monsters should be careful lest he thereby become a monster. And if thou gaze long into an abyss, the abyss will also gaze into thee."

Which versions are preferable? -- Jimregan 14:12, 14 Sep 2003 (UTC)

Personally I prefer the current versions on Wikiquote, however personal preference doesn't count for much. Is there any way we can verify one set as being more definitive than the other? Actually since I assume all of these were originally in German, we should have the German originals (which I assume have only one version), and then the translations (see Template for the formatting). Nanobug 14:48, 15 Sep 2003 (UTC)
Therein lies the problem - I don't have access to a German source. If I find one somewhere, I think I remember enough German to extract the relevant portions. I'm currently trawling through Wikiquote:Public domain resource -- Jimregan 19:36, 15 Sep 2003 (UTC)
Found two; the one I'm using and a Project Gutenberg etext -- Jimregan 21:18, 15 Sep 2003 (UTC)

"If one trains one's conscience it will kiss us as it bites."[edit]

I always thought the "kiss" was something... bad. Not "kick", seems I just didn't notice the word. Anyone care to give their interpretation of this quote?

I don't take it as 'bad', merely the showing of compassion, gentle remonstration while righting our thinking to the correct path...


Krishna: Thou grievest where no grief should be! thou speak'st Words lacking wisdom! for the wise in heart Mourn not for those that live, nor those that die. Nor I, nor thou, nor any one of these, Ever was not, nor ever will not be, For ever and for ever afterwards. All, that doth live, lives always! To man's frame As there come infancy and youth and age, So come there raisings-up and layings-down Of other and of other life-abodes, Which the wise know, and fear not. This that irks-- Thy sense-life, thrilling to the elements-- Bringing thee heat and cold, sorrows and joys, 'Tis brief and mutable! Bear with it, Prince! As the wise bear. The soul which is not moved, The soul that with a strong and constant calm Takes sorrow and takes joy indifferently, Lives in the life undying! That which is Can never cease to be; that which is not Will not exist. To see this truth of both Is theirs who part essence from accident, Substance from shadow. Indestructible, Learn thou! the Life is, spreading life through all; It cannot anywhere, by any means, Be anywise diminished, stayed, or changed. But for these fleeting frames which it informs With spirit deathless, endless, infinite, They perish. Let them perish, Prince! and fight! He who shall say, "Lo! I have slain a man!" He who shall think, "Lo! I am slain!" those both Know naught! Life cannot slay. Life is not slain! Never the spirit was born; the spirit shall cease to be never; Never was time it was not; End and Beginning are dreams! Birthless and deathless and changeless remaineth the spirit for ever; Death hath not touched it at all, dead though the house of it seems!

http://manybooks.net/pages/anonetext00bgita10/12.html

Study points:

- Vedanta invented by ancient Aryans - All life is continuous, nothing created or destroyed - Idea and Order more important than individual lives - Reality is like dreams or thoughts