User talk:Kalki/2004

Administrator nomination

Hello Kalki. I've nominated you for adminship at Wikisource. Please reply there to say if you accept or not. Thanks for all your work over there. :) Angela 02:29, 17 January 2004 (UTC)

I also suggested you be made a sysop here as you and Nanobug are practically the only editors. You might want to check out the Wikiquote:Votes for deletion page. There are some things that have been waiting since October. :) Angela 04:56, 29 Jan 2004 (UTC)

You're now an administrator. -- Tim Starling 04:50, 29 Jan 2004 (UTC)

Hegel

Kalki! Thank you so very much for cleaning up my Hegel quotes. -Saltykov-Shchedrin

Links within quotes

After consideration I agree with you and have stopped adding links within quotes. Thanks. Hyacinth 21:58, 27 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Category options

I am waiting to see what categories develop on the wikipedia before commiting to any category scheme here. ~ Kalki

Thanks for your comments. My only problem is the way I'm filling up Special:Recentchanges... Oh, well if people want to see minor edits the'll get what they deserve ;-) - Tobin Richard 01:46, 26 May 2004 (UTC)

Television shows

Kalki , thank you for the nice welcome message on my User Talk page. I also wanted to let you know that I moved the Television Shows article to Television shows (just a case change). Your User page had the only link I didn't revise, as I didn't feel comfortable updating someone's User page. (I'm bold, but not that bold.) ☺ -- Jeff Q 02:31, 29 May 2004 (UTC)

Dialog styles

Re: dialog style. Agreed, I don't want to force anything on people either. I find some of the styles hard to read tho. I think a discussion would bring out the best styles. Should I remove the "Supprt" section for now? -- Jeandré, 2004-06-12t00:26z

There probably isn't a need to remove it, but I think it should serve just as a gauge for preferences, and any reasons people have for them, and not a poll for establishing any rules. ~ Kalki 01:21, 14 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Kalki - origins and uses of the name

I was just wandering through Wikipedia when I ran across the Dasavatara (under Avatar). Kalki, eh? " "Destroyer of Confusion", "Destroyer of Darkness", and "Annihilator of Ignorance" make excellent noms de wiki. But aren't you 428,000 years early? ☺ -- fellow Kate Bush fan Jeff Q 06:37, 30 May 2004 (UTC)

I am quite mystical in many of my perspectives on things, and interested in fighting with fairness against what foulness I can, but I certainly make no claims to be the Maha Avatara that some have anticipated. Even so, it's never too early to get involved with the dissipation of ignorance, confusion, and indifference to the things that matter most in whatever capacities you honorably can, and to do what good you can, in those ways that you are most capable of doing. Kate is one of those who has been doing this for years in her own passionate ways, and I'm glad to find another fan of her work involved in these Wiki-realms.

Another tidbit on the name Kalki: besides the Hindu and Buddhist usages, and a few others I'm familiar with, reference to Kalki also became prominent among the ideas of fantasist-satirist James Branch Cabell, who was a great inspiration to Robert Heinlein. I surmised that you might also be a fan of RAH because of the rather distinctive use of the term "discorporation" on your page. I must confess that I am one of those odd people who tend to object to anyone being called "completely useless" even in jest by themselves, but like Valentine Michael Smith I have learned to laugh at some of the absurd and distorting ways we humans use language, words, and statements, as well as to greatly cherish some of the best. ~ Kalki 09:31, 31 May 2004 (UTC)

Bolding of parts of quotes

Okay, I frankly hadn't realized that had been done with forethought. I had seen a couple of quote-lists where two or three whole quotes out of several dozen were bolded, just as a few others out of the list were placed in quote marks but not all the others. I took this to be sloppy input by individuals who hadn't bothered to look at the whole article and note predecessors' style (. . . and if those weren't done by you, probably that was the case, in those cases). Anyway, I won't assume hereafter that bolding needs "fixing"!

I've been active mostly on Wikipedia, but I'm also a longtime quote collector and there are a lot of major names I don't see included at all. I'll be adding new pages for Sir Thomas More, William Jennings Bryan, Lily Tomlin, Truman Capote, and quite a few others. Michael K. Smith 19:34, 5 Jul 2004 (UTC)

lynx

Well, actually, I had seen this mentioned as an option only near the top of the Templates page -- but with no description of what it does or how or where to apply it, nor anything in the relevant Talk, either. Does this mechanism automatically insert the page title (i.e., the name) in the List of People? Or does it work more like categories, with no browsable list? Not to carp here, but if you're going to invent things, you need to market them. . . . ---Michael K. Smith 20:42, 7 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Reduced activity likely from me

I normally try to check in on Wikiquote at least every few hours; once or twice a week I might be out of contact as much as 12 hrs at a time, but that is usually the biggest gap that occurs. I try to contribute at least a little every few days with a few more quotes from the many files I am gradually formatting and drawing upon on my hard drives, but this week I might not contribute so much as normal. I am linked right now through an connection from a Powerbook I recently bought, but many of the files and programs I normally use have not yet been loaded onto it. The iMac on my desktop is still functioning, but its ethernet port was knocked out by a thunderstorm yesterday; I saw the spark and heard the pop that killed it, when lightning struck a line nearby. Right now, I have an immense amount of material to organize, programs to install, and many preferences to configure on my most used utility programs. I hope to have my iMac online again within the week, but am considering what networking options remain to me. I am trying to keep the Powerbook a bit more streamlined and organized than the iMac has been, and I have literally many thousands of files to review and sort. Though I had hoped to make a few more additions to Wikiquote this weekend (when server traffic usually seems lightest), and still might, my other file sorting activity will definitely keep me busy. This is basically just a note of explanation as to why I might not seem so active as normal over the next week or so. I still plan to monitor things, and take care of any essentials… but the mishap with the lightning bolt has forced me to shift much of my attention to organizing my own information files and exploring my options for re-connecting with my desktop machine. I will still be around, just probably not as active here as I normally try to be. ~ Kalki 18:59, 10 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Many other activities and concerns have kept me a bit less active than normal here over the last few weeks, and the failure of one of my primary hard drives yesterday has complicated things for me a bit more. I still usually check in a few times a day, but it wll probably now be at least another week before I have my personal computers set up to my satisfaction, and have the time to provide any extensive amount of contributions. It is good to see that lately other contributors are becoming more active and I wish to thank everyone for what interesting quotations they are providing. ~ Kalki 12:44, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Automagical Namespace Supression

Hey Kalki, just FYI and so you can add it to any relevant how-to or template pages you might create, Wiki allows supression of namespaces automatically with a pipe. [[w:Author|]] and [[User:Kalki|]] are equivalent to [[w:Author|Author]] and [[User:Kalki|Kalki]] Regards, Stevesliva

"Title entries"

How do you suggest handling title-entries like Cinema is in a unique position to throw light on the fact that reality is a mass hallucination? Is there a useful strategy or an automatic method for hunting them down? I suspect there're a lot of these things.... --Michael K. Smith 18:04, 26 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Pardon me for 'butting in' - 'What links here' brought me to this page from Cinema is in a unique position to throw light on the fact that reality is a mass hallucination. I moved the page, which makes the quote a link to the author. I am thinking this is a good thing, so a quote can be entered and take one directly to the listing. comments?Pedant 02:57, 11 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Replied to on User talk:Pedant

Not-so-speedy deletions

As the only Wikiquote admin I've conversed with, I thought I'd ask you how long one might expect a "speedy deletion" request take to be completed. My posting of LuLu Ebeling is now six days old, which suggests it might have been faster to post it under VfD! Also, I see that Wikiquote uses Wikipedia's deletion policy instead of having one of its own. I know Wikipedia is orders of magnitude more busy, so I wonder if there are any different lag times for ordinary VfD requests. Thanks for your help. — Jeff Q 00:09, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Replied to on User talk:Jeff Q

General format question

Hello Kalki! I've migrated over here some from Wikipedia, and I have a question to ask. What is the proper format for entries? I've seen quotes that use quotation marks and some that don't...do you think you could clarify this for me? Sorry if it's addressed elsewhere--maybe I'm just not looking in the right places. --Pie4all88 04:50, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)

One more thing, while I'm at it--where would I post the Russian proverb "Education is light, lack of its darkness."? Is there a place for quotes that come from a certain nationality or would it just go under Anonymous? --Pie4all88 04:50, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Placing quotation marks around quotes was decided as policy very early on, but it is one that I frankly find tedious, ridiculous, and UGLY and do not enforce, nor usually obey, though I did for a time. It was decided by a vote of a few people at a very early stage, most of whom made very few contributions before or since, and it is a policy I never thought should be imposed or adopted. There are a few issues that it might be appropriate to vote upon soon, and this is an issue I personally would wish to see voted upon again. The Russian proverb would be fine on the Russian proverbs page. I am in a bit of a rush right now, and am rushing in my answers. I might elaborate on them later. ~ Kalki 15:56, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Ok, thanks a lot Kalki. I only have the translation of that proverb I was talking about, so I guess I shouldn't put it there. Again, thanks for the help. --Pie4all88 23:12, 29 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Logo

Hello Kalki,

I put this in Nanobug's talk page, but I thought I'd messge you too, as you are also an admin.

Just noticing that the logo is not transparent, and I can provide a transparent one if you like so that it sits better with the page. If there are any other little tidbits that I can do to improve it, let me know. You might also want to suggest updating the logo on the wikimediafoundation.org site. It still is the old disproportionate arcs logo.

Transparent PNG logo:

I darkened the text a little so it would stand out more against a non-white background.

Cheers,

Neolux 02:25, 1 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Quote of the day

Hiya. You seem to be the "maintainer" of the Wikiquote QotD, so I thought I'd just drop you a note to say that (starting today) the English Wikipedia's "article of the day" email (mail:daily-article-l) will also include today's QotD. Regards — Kate Turner | Talk 05:44, 2 Sep 2004 (UTC)

UVa website on Prem Rawat and the very first edit war on Wikiquote

It is a bit sad that the first edit war has occured here though it would have happened anyway. The reasons why I do not insist on adding the UvA website [1] as external link to the Prem Rawat entry is that we already had such a difficult editing proces in Wikipedia, and I and my adversery do not want to repeat it here. We confine ourselves to quotes here, which is already difficult enough, as you can read on the talk:Prem Rawat.

I want to make some general remarks about the UVa website on religious movement. The entries were written by many different students of the late Jeffrey Hadden and were not proofread and as could be expected from them, the quality differs dependent on the student. For example the entry on Sathya Sai Baba [2], my former guru, contains very serious factual mistakes (confusing w:Shirdi Sai Baba with w:Sathya Sai Baba). In contrast, I believe that the entry on Elan Vital/Prem Rawat is quite good. Though it should be noted that the entry refers to beliefs and practices that are obsolete. After Douglas Cowan took over the website from Jeffrey Hadden the website will be updated, as he wrote in an email to me, but this takes time, of course. Andries 20:23, 11 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Categories

Thanks for the compliments. I categorized most of the main page's stuff, though not all themes are done. I realized part of the way through that there's probably too many themes to put in one category, so subcategories would probably be best for them all. I probably missed a few articles here and there while I was working, so there's probably others that need to be categorized still. And I wouldn't want to hog all the fun for myself, after all. :) -- LGagnon (talk) 20:22, 26 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Wikimedia Commons

The Wikimedia Commons project is developing as a site to store GNU FDL and public domain images that can be used across all Wikimedia projects. It is still in its preliminary stages, and this comment is just a preliminary test to see how it works with the Wikiquote software. Further information upon it will be posted more prominently, in the days and weeks ahead. ~ Kalki 22:45, 13 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Test 1 : Buddha ~ Test 2: A Buddha statue

Test 3:

File:Lightmatter buddha with swastika.jpg

A Buddha statue

Test 4:

A Buddha in white stone

• Notice about Wikimedia Commons from Erik Möller (W:User:Eloquence)

Removal of genuine quotes from Prem Rawat by user:Jossifresco

I strongly object to removal of genuine quotes by user Jossifresco whom I believe to be the same person as ip 64.81.88.140 Could you please help? Read this to understand the background of the conflict. Thanks Andries 17:11, 21 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Please see my response at talk:Prem Rawat ≈ jossi ≈ 22:13, 21 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Google

• I've noticed that wikiquote is NOT rated well when one searches for quotes or quotations on google or yahoo. While wikipedia is well (searching encyclopedia) in both, and of course that is expected, but I was wondering if we can improve the results for wikiquote? For example; Wikipedia's (tittle bar) home page actually contains the word encyclopedia, it also contains vast amount of links - should we place more links in wikipedia that direct it to wikiquote ex: [[wikiquote|The Fog of War]] vs. [http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/The_Fog_of_War] ?

I also wonder how do you deal with SPAM so fast, I saw you revert vandalism really fast on couple pages - and is this a big problem on the wiki'? If so how can we deal with it, I'm sure the idea has been brought up, but wouldn't it be better for people to log in with a user name before they can edit - after it still will be free, it will act as (minor) deterrent, atleast to those that are too lasy to sing-in, plust it be much easier to bloc User-Names, rather than IP'adds.

But thanks for the contributions, I want this place to be in the top 10 of search results. RoboAction 22:37, 3 Dec 2004 (UTC)

PS what do you think about the format for The Fog of War or for that matter my other ideas of formats dealing with films...Wikiquote talk:Templates

Benn of Woodrow Wilson fame

Thanks for your welcome, Kalki.

I will do what I can now adding things to the Commons. Whatever I can't verify as being in the public domain I do not use; for things I've already found on Wiki sites, I assume they have been cleared.

Thanks again for your hospitality. Bennmorland 05:32, 5 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Found this. Bennmorland 05:37, 5 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Stubs - expand

I was wondering if we can create a system of stubs as we do in wikipedia -- the section I am concentrating on is the film and tv section, so I would like to create (article specific stub) such as the {{movie-stub}} being offered on 'pedia (I may need help in doing so - the logistics). This could really help out on some of these articles...we would have a clean list of sections/articles that need to be worked on, so users can browse for their film that's on the list and improve best they can.

I created atleast one format style that may be of interest, but I am planning on creating more and I am looking for input, you may find this at my sandbox. My main concern is to seperate us from IMDb, because IMDb may be ok or even good, it is not great for quotes...difficult to browse, etc. So I feel our strength at wikiqoute is to keep the quotes clean and easily editable (what?). I will be updating a few articles by the end of this week, I will also discuss more of options in dealing with TV shows and Films...
see also: -- Film TV Debate -- Film Talk -- TV Talk -- PEACE RoboAction 22:51, 6 Dec 2004 (UTC)

choosing of my inclination

I appreciate your comment on my talk page. I will not be defending myself here, for I feel it’s unnecessary, but I will clarify on the "choosing of my inclination". First, I am not claiming to know the solution for proper Wikiquote formatting, but I do have a firm belief in what a appropriate film quotation looks and feels like. It’s why you see me focusing my energy in the Film category of wikiquote, and not in People - yet, you will find me placing “stubs” on people such as Rudy Giuliani because common sense tells me - he’s said more and we need to hear it -

The criteria I perceived to be important, and thus judged the articles on, were: A clear statement on who is this person and/or what is this film about - (damn at least give me a genre), who said what? Who created this work (this is not only being responsible to the creators but possible copyright violations - give credit where credit is do) ? [I also like seeing links going back to wikipedia and using lynx templates, not to spice up the article, but to make it user-friendly].

If I may take a random sample of the articles I selected for Stubs or Clean-up; Dumb and Dumber - Clearly a classic and many of us can recite great lines from the film off the top of our head, but at it’s current state this does not show that and it’s why I view it as a clear Stub. (Chinatown, Titanic, A Few Good Men, are some extreme examples). In-regards to Cleanups, I was mainly concerned with the user perception - that is, if some someone was to stumble across A Beautiful Mind - would they have gained anything out of it, after all, what do these lines of words mean? Another term we may use is Wikify, but I see no need to create this as a useless template, it’s simply implied that hey, this article is just about there...just clean it up and wikify it. I mean to see some of these articles is a shame to the classics that they are: Wayne's World, Forrest Gump, Magnolia, and Life of Brian...incoherent.

Some may view me as an asshole, I say hey, I’m a jerk, but not an asshole. On some talking points since I’m here; I would personally like articles that appear on the Main Page to be examples of high standard so to show a quick example: Clue - clearly I have no idea what this film is about (if it is a film after all), who said what,? [It’s a complete mess, and it’s why I view it as a perfect candidate for a clean-up (wikify)].

I’m going to take a camping break, thanks for your kind words and your contributions, till then, PEACE RoboAction

Use of colons in section headers

I am certainly the primary culprit in having put colons at the end of many section headers, but repented of my error, when I found it interferes with the ability to direct links to these sections of pages. I encourage the deletion of all colons in section headers, everywhere they are encountered, as I am doing now on this page. I know that such use of colons is mostly likely to be found in the "External links" sections of many pages that I have worked on in the past.~ Kalki 00:23, 14 Dec 2004 (UTC)

LotR quote of the day

I bring this up here because you seem to have the ability to edit that page. I can't figure out where else to bring this up.

The current quote of the day needs to be changed. It's from the book (The Fellowship of the Ring) and is included once in a letter written by Gandalf and once it is recited by Bilbo Baggins, who says he wrote it (about Aragorn). The fact that Arwen says it in the movie is secondary to that, and it looks somewhat sloppy to credit the film. -Aranel 00:26, 18 Dec 2004 (UTC)

If you don't have a chance to change it on the quote of the day, it definitely should be corrected in the archive. -Aranel 00:28, 18 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Categories

Alright, so I did push the Random page button a few times, but I did discover some flaws. I know the issue of categorizing articles is of a new concern, but I see positive affect from this, for example, this idea of double-entry is not needed and we need to educate/show others on how not to do this. Maintance procedure may look like this; to check Maintance is to use the categories as a browse function: so if you want to see quickly what articles have been added with a {{vfd}} notice - you can check out the Category:Votes for deletion, and not worry if the user/contributer also placed it on a list somewhere to be found.

More sperficially, if a user wants to contribute to wikiquote, they can browse to the appropriate (their favorite section) and help with the request - ex. a person who likes the people section, can find the people stubs section and easily see which one he/she wants to work on. These cat. lists are self-maintance - once the user does their contribution, they also remove the tag and walla.

I really want to work on getting this sight ranked higher on search engines. The only ground it's holding now is, as you mentioned, the connection with wikipedia. At the moment-thinking out loud (and writing it here) I see couple of options:

1. We encourage users from wikipedia to journey to wikiquote and contribute where they can
2. We stick to the classic "How to be found on the web" points: Alt. tags in photos, using KEYWORDS throughout our site (Quotations, Quotes, Proverbs...etc), It needs to get specific, so when I am on the List of films page - the blue top bar should say, "Film (movie) quoatations, quotes."
3. We need to get linked from more places, collaborate with others
4. Need to spark an interest...
5. Plus all those other ideas....coming soon

You mentioned before that you have something in mind on how to accomplish this, is the time to share the idea out yet? Myself, I'll begin doing what I can, and I am striving to make www.wikiquote.org a solid contendor in it's own right; but according to the web ranking Alexa.com we are at 44,924 (but growing steadily) Our site information is lacking information and also minor data points - So to get the word out, and attrack several Users should be our main focus, after all, the power of users is they grow exponentionaly. PEACE ~ RoboAction 09:51, 18 Dec 2004 (UTC)

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You seem much more familiar with the category functions that have been developed than I yet am, and I agree that they are very useful, and should become the primary method of cataloging pages, but is there a way to link to a Category page within a sentence yet? I am not familiar with a method to make a link other than those that occur at the bottom of a page, and it would be useful to know a method of linking from within a statement, as I do now with the current List of films.
As for some of my ideas for increasing activity and interest here, I really haven't been aiming at increasing visibility or "hooking people in" through various links and Keywords and such, but I do not object to others attempting to do so, in at least a few ways. I simply feel we need many more pages yet of notable people and works, and many more highly notable quotes, yet always retaining a clear emphasis on increasing our reliability by correcting errors, and gradually moving most "Attributed" quotes into sections for "Sourced" quotes. One of the ideas I've had, that I have recently mentioned elsewhere, is to simply have pages for very large lists with names of people and films that are candidates for pages here, but NOT with active links to any uncreated page. I am still gathering up names, and editing such a list for people, and hope to have a list of perhaps a couple thousand names ready within the next few days. This could spark at least a few more people to seek out some quotes of notable people that we do not yet have, and provide a visible gauge of our progress in coming months. I agree with other editors that having many red links on a listing page is not a good idea, and conceive these as initially pages of suggestions and ideas, with links made active only as the pages are actually created, or about to be. I myself have not done any work on such a page for films yet (and to better conform with Wikipedia usage I think we should generally refer to these as "movies", especially in our page titles here). A few other ideas that I have I am still tweaking a bit, and I do hope to have them ready soon as well. Your efforts and enthusiasm are very welcome, and many of your own ideas are probably worth pursuing and developing into formal suggestions for everyone to consider.
Just as an aside: I noticed a typo "quoatations" in your above note: this bit of mistyping seems to regularly occur with me, but I normally catch it, and it's amusing to see that I am not totally alone in this; perhaps such mistyping should occur in any invisible "Keyword" lists that are made, if we decide to use them here. ~ Kalki 19:02, 18 Dec 2004 (UTC)

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